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Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
- Anji
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5 months 1 week ago #292383 by Anji
Replied by Anji on topic Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
Hi Gringo
Sadly your experience sounds all too familiar. My son's assessment, which was undertaken by a pharmacist, was brief but contained over 40 inaccuracies and errors. These ranged from simple things - like saying he told her he wore glasses for his eyesight (he has never worn glasses) - through what I generously think of 'mistakes' such as reporting a 15 minute bus journey as a 50 minute one - all the way to downright untrue, such as saying he didn't report any interrupted journeys when we recounted how he fainted on the platform one time when he got so overwhelmed! The report was completely full of these. I think the assessor had made her mind up before the assessment and written most of the report in advance.
You can complain about the report, I wish I had done so before you get the decision letter and this has, for some people, resulted in them cancelling and re-doing the assessment. However, definitely apply for a mandatory reconsideration.
Good luck, and do let us know how you get on!
Anji
Sadly your experience sounds all too familiar. My son's assessment, which was undertaken by a pharmacist, was brief but contained over 40 inaccuracies and errors. These ranged from simple things - like saying he told her he wore glasses for his eyesight (he has never worn glasses) - through what I generously think of 'mistakes' such as reporting a 15 minute bus journey as a 50 minute one - all the way to downright untrue, such as saying he didn't report any interrupted journeys when we recounted how he fainted on the platform one time when he got so overwhelmed! The report was completely full of these. I think the assessor had made her mind up before the assessment and written most of the report in advance.
You can complain about the report, I wish I had done so before you get the decision letter and this has, for some people, resulted in them cancelling and re-doing the assessment. However, definitely apply for a mandatory reconsideration.
Good luck, and do let us know how you get on!
Anji
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- BIS
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5 months 1 week ago #292389 by BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by BIS on topic Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
Hi Gringo2000
I've just read your post for the first time. I'm intrigued that you got hold of the notes through a SAR—interesting. I wonder how many of the notes are due to deliberate lies, poor notetaking, possible mixing up claimants, or old-fashioned incompetence. All possibilities are worrying and unacceptable, but any deliberate lies are unforgivable. Once you get the decision - you'll be able to put in for an MR, and at that point, I think you should say that the report has so many mistakes that it is discriminatory and cannot be trusted. In your MR - I would not call the assessor a liar. You can say that she has "incorrectly recorded", she is "mistaken" she has "misunderstood" she has "committed". You can even say that you are concerned that these actions might have been deliberate - but I would not call her a liar - because you have no proof that they deliberately lied. You only have proof that they appear incompetent and negligent, falling well below professional standards. You don't want them to get fixed on the harshness of your language - you want it to be obvious the stark difference between what your sister said and what was recorded.
You say a report can just be written off. Yes, sometimes they are, and another assessment is carried out. As you are your sister's appointee, you can do the assessment for her, and I would insist on it - if they agree, another one should be done. Don't let them fob you off with - they need to speak to her - they don't. The point of an appointee is that you can speak and manage on behalf of the claimant.
BIS
I've just read your post for the first time. I'm intrigued that you got hold of the notes through a SAR—interesting. I wonder how many of the notes are due to deliberate lies, poor notetaking, possible mixing up claimants, or old-fashioned incompetence. All possibilities are worrying and unacceptable, but any deliberate lies are unforgivable. Once you get the decision - you'll be able to put in for an MR, and at that point, I think you should say that the report has so many mistakes that it is discriminatory and cannot be trusted. In your MR - I would not call the assessor a liar. You can say that she has "incorrectly recorded", she is "mistaken" she has "misunderstood" she has "committed". You can even say that you are concerned that these actions might have been deliberate - but I would not call her a liar - because you have no proof that they deliberately lied. You only have proof that they appear incompetent and negligent, falling well below professional standards. You don't want them to get fixed on the harshness of your language - you want it to be obvious the stark difference between what your sister said and what was recorded.
You say a report can just be written off. Yes, sometimes they are, and another assessment is carried out. As you are your sister's appointee, you can do the assessment for her, and I would insist on it - if they agree, another one should be done. Don't let them fob you off with - they need to speak to her - they don't. The point of an appointee is that you can speak and manage on behalf of the claimant.
BIS
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- Gringo2000
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5 months 1 week ago #292406 by Gringo2000
Replied by Gringo2000 on topic Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
I have written up a 28 page complaint - this is how ridiculous my sisters assessment report is.
It is being sent to the CDHA tomorrow - along with copies of the audio recording.
I have also discovered that despite having her assessment in April of this year, the assessor has used an ESA50 form, and medical evidence, from 2017 - SEVEN YEARS AGO!
That seven year old ESA50 contains medical conditions that my sister no longer has - and it excludes medical conditions that she has been diagnosed with within the past 3 or 4 years.
It is LUDICROUS that they have used an ESA50 from from 2017 to carry out an assessment in 2024.
Surely that alone is a breach of the legislation.
I have been careful with my choice of wording at times, but where I have sufficient proof that she has lied, I have called her a liar - and I will not tone down my choice of words on those occasions.
For example, I asked the assessor, towards the end of the assessment, if, in the bundle of evidence that she had in front of her, she had documentary evidence of my sisters wheelchair.
She said yes.
However, having obtained copies of the evidence that she had in front of her, I can see that she had NO EVIDENCE related to my sisters wheelchair at all.
It is clear on that occasion that she lied - therefore, I have called her one. The audio recording I have is sufficient evidence to prove that she is a liar - therefore, I cannot be pursued for defamation.
She has also written my sisters supposed "personal statement" in her own words, and it is full of lies. She has used terms like "She said" or "she stated", when my sister never said anything of the sort.
Again, therefore, she has lied - and my audio recording clearly proves that.
It is being sent to the CDHA tomorrow - along with copies of the audio recording.
I have also discovered that despite having her assessment in April of this year, the assessor has used an ESA50 form, and medical evidence, from 2017 - SEVEN YEARS AGO!
That seven year old ESA50 contains medical conditions that my sister no longer has - and it excludes medical conditions that she has been diagnosed with within the past 3 or 4 years.
It is LUDICROUS that they have used an ESA50 from from 2017 to carry out an assessment in 2024.
Surely that alone is a breach of the legislation.
but I would not call her a liar - because you have no proof that they deliberately lied
I have been careful with my choice of wording at times, but where I have sufficient proof that she has lied, I have called her a liar - and I will not tone down my choice of words on those occasions.
For example, I asked the assessor, towards the end of the assessment, if, in the bundle of evidence that she had in front of her, she had documentary evidence of my sisters wheelchair.
She said yes.
However, having obtained copies of the evidence that she had in front of her, I can see that she had NO EVIDENCE related to my sisters wheelchair at all.
It is clear on that occasion that she lied - therefore, I have called her one. The audio recording I have is sufficient evidence to prove that she is a liar - therefore, I cannot be pursued for defamation.
She has also written my sisters supposed "personal statement" in her own words, and it is full of lies. She has used terms like "She said" or "she stated", when my sister never said anything of the sort.
Again, therefore, she has lied - and my audio recording clearly proves that.
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- LL26
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5 months 1 week ago #292408 by LL26
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by LL26 on topic Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
Hi Gringo2000,
I agree with BIS, however strongly you feel that the assessor was lying, I would never say that in a complaint.
I have previously complained about a substandard assessment report. I kept the complaint part very short, using four or five bullet points, and then referred to the transcript annotated with the errors using highlighter and or neat comment in the margin, or a larger explanation at the end if required.
I would start the letter- I am writing to complain about Mr X and the quality of his report writing.
The report should not be relied upon.
I made a recording of the assessment. There are 149 discrepancies in what I can clearly be heard to say on the recording as to what is actually written.
The following are examples (4 or 5 bullets)
•
•
ETC ETC
I enclose an annotated copy of the transcript of the recording showing all the errors.
I look forward to receive within 14 days of the date of this letter
1. written confirmation that
the Assessment report made by Mr X on [date]will NOT be used as evidence in my PIP claim
2. A full written explanation of what action has been taken to ensure no recurrence will happen - including full details of disciplinary action against Mr X and any more general preventative measures
Yours faithfully....
You can tailor the letter to fit your own circumstances.
I hope this helps.
Good luck.
LL26
I agree with BIS, however strongly you feel that the assessor was lying, I would never say that in a complaint.
I have previously complained about a substandard assessment report. I kept the complaint part very short, using four or five bullet points, and then referred to the transcript annotated with the errors using highlighter and or neat comment in the margin, or a larger explanation at the end if required.
I would start the letter- I am writing to complain about Mr X and the quality of his report writing.
The report should not be relied upon.
I made a recording of the assessment. There are 149 discrepancies in what I can clearly be heard to say on the recording as to what is actually written.
The following are examples (4 or 5 bullets)
•
•
ETC ETC
I enclose an annotated copy of the transcript of the recording showing all the errors.
I look forward to receive within 14 days of the date of this letter
1. written confirmation that
the Assessment report made by Mr X on [date]will NOT be used as evidence in my PIP claim
2. A full written explanation of what action has been taken to ensure no recurrence will happen - including full details of disciplinary action against Mr X and any more general preventative measures
Yours faithfully....
You can tailor the letter to fit your own circumstances.
I hope this helps.
Good luck.
LL26
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
The following user(s) said Thank You: anees292, Anji
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- Bud
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5 months 6 days ago #292432 by Bud
Replied by Bud on topic Assessor caught telling lies. Can the report be written off?
It is indeed enraging when this happens. You open up to complete strangers & tell them things that you’d rather not. Then after going through all of that, they as good as call you, a liar. If the assessor said you’re OK with that or you can manage. I say that’s not what I said or meant, & go on to explain. In the PA4 the dog that I enjoy walking & the car that I drive daily was mentioned. The assessment has been recorded & there was no mention of this by either of us, because neither exist! Just keep pointing out that the assessments was recorded, this way you keep your dignity.
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