- Posts: 20
× Members
Medication - more points?
- Mitch
- Topic Author
- Offline
Less More
11 months 1 week ago #286526 by Mitch
Medication - more points? was created by Mitch
Hi all,
Does having medication mean you get more points on activities?
I scored a lot of 0 points in activities and the assessor’s reasons were:
“The evidence in the HOC notes no current input from mental health services and medication notes no medication for mental health.”
Thanks in advance for your help!
Does having medication mean you get more points on activities?
I scored a lot of 0 points in activities and the assessor’s reasons were:
“The evidence in the HOC notes no current input from mental health services and medication notes no medication for mental health.”
Thanks in advance for your help!
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Gordon
- Offline
Less More
- Posts: 51288
11 months 1 week ago #286534 by Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gordon on topic Medication - more points?
M
Taking your question literally then no, taking medication does not score extra points.
However, this is about assessing the severity of your conditions and whether it is reasonable to assume the limitations that you have indicated on your claim/review form.
The thought process is that someone who does not take medication does not have issues severe enough to meet the criteria to score points. There may be reasons why an individual might not take anything for their conditions from allergy to religious reasons, so it is not a solid rule but anybody in this situation will struggle to score.
If there has been no medical referral then this will further compound the problem, this is particularly the case for mental health issues, it's easy to relate to the problem when you see a cast on someone's leg, but not so much for depression, ADHD, Autism, etc.
Gordon
Taking your question literally then no, taking medication does not score extra points.
However, this is about assessing the severity of your conditions and whether it is reasonable to assume the limitations that you have indicated on your claim/review form.
The thought process is that someone who does not take medication does not have issues severe enough to meet the criteria to score points. There may be reasons why an individual might not take anything for their conditions from allergy to religious reasons, so it is not a solid rule but anybody in this situation will struggle to score.
If there has been no medical referral then this will further compound the problem, this is particularly the case for mental health issues, it's easy to relate to the problem when you see a cast on someone's leg, but not so much for depression, ADHD, Autism, etc.
Gordon
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
The following user(s) said Thank You: Mitch
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- honeyhoney
- Offline
Less More
- Posts: 5
11 months 1 week ago #286539 by honeyhoney
Replied by honeyhoney on topic Medication - more points?
Hi
This is standard "copy & paste"
I'm currently at the MRI stage
What counter-arguments should I use to this:
"The evidence shows no current input from mental health services and medication are effective"
I did attach a letter stating that I am currently on CBT Therapy and that I am on the highest dose of anti-depressant.
This is standard "copy & paste"
I'm currently at the MRI stage
What counter-arguments should I use to this:
"The evidence shows no current input from mental health services and medication are effective"
I did attach a letter stating that I am currently on CBT Therapy and that I am on the highest dose of anti-depressant.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- BIS
- Offline
Less More
- Posts: 8411
11 months 1 week ago #286543 by BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by BIS on topic Medication - more points?
Hi honeyhoney
Say something like "The assessor was incorrect in stating that I have no input from mental health services - see letter attached from (person/service/date) which shows I am currently having CBT because of my (give reason). I included this information on my original review form (date).
I don't know how much you expanded in the first place, but pinpoint what you said on the form or at the assessment.
With regard to the medication. You say that you are on the highest dosage of your anti-depressant. Quote from the NiCE website - which has the recommended dose - bnf.nice.org.uk/ - that way they can't argue it.
Did you tell the assessor your medication was effective? If you didn't then you need to say that they were mistaken and then say what if any difference the medication has made. Include any side effects you have from the medication that make life difficult.
BIS
Say something like "The assessor was incorrect in stating that I have no input from mental health services - see letter attached from (person/service/date) which shows I am currently having CBT because of my (give reason). I included this information on my original review form (date).
I don't know how much you expanded in the first place, but pinpoint what you said on the form or at the assessment.
With regard to the medication. You say that you are on the highest dosage of your anti-depressant. Quote from the NiCE website - which has the recommended dose - bnf.nice.org.uk/ - that way they can't argue it.
Did you tell the assessor your medication was effective? If you didn't then you need to say that they were mistaken and then say what if any difference the medication has made. Include any side effects you have from the medication that make life difficult.
BIS
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- honeyhoney
- Offline
Less More
- Posts: 5
11 months 1 week ago #286554 by honeyhoney
Replied by honeyhoney on topic Medication - more points?
BIS Thank you
still waiting for HP report In the meantime, I wrote an MR template It would be nice to hear the opinion of someone experienced in this process
"I am writing to you to request a mandatory reconsideration following your decision dated 11.12.2023 for my application for PIP. I disagree with the decision not to award PIP the daily living component and the mobility component
In reaching your decision I believe you have not take into account all the circumstances that were not known to you but could have a significant impact on the final award.
• Health Professional Assessment
I would like to emphasize that it is not my intention to question or criticize the assessor or the report itself.
I would rather say that I was misunderstood during the telephone assessment or that the translator (English is not my first language) translated my answers incorrectly.
I believe that an important factor supporting my statement were the conditions in which the assessment took place.
Well, according to the attached documents (please see: audiology report, etc, etc...) I suffer from serious hearing loss.
On the day of the assessment, I didn't have my hearing aids and neck loop yet. In order to understand anything, I had to connect my phone to a portable speaker via Bluetooth, which allowed me to amplify the sound, but not everything was understandable to me.
At the very beginning, the assessor seemed to be very nervous and even started arguing with the interpreter that he was hearing some sounds (probably an echo or some feedback) and could not comfortably conduct the conversation.
I informed her that I use the Bluetooth loudspeaker and I have to hold it close to my ear when I am unable to conduct a conversation on the phone otherwise.
This assessment took a very short time and I think that it was for the reasons I mentioned that the assessor could have based his report on my answers, which were misunderstood translated.
• Decision Marker Report -
You said: "Evidence shows you have no specialist input for any musculoskeletal condition"
I would like to explain to you that I have been under the care of my GP and physiotherapist since February 2023 when I reported my problems.
I was then informed that their procedure involves referral to a physiotherapist who is located in the same medical centre as my GP. If the procedures they propose do not work, I will be referred to an external specialist.
For evidence, please see the attached documents: doc1, doc2, doc4, etc.
As you can see, it is clear from them that I underwent "in-house physiotherapy" and performed the recommended exercises at home. It was only in September that I was referred by my GP to Dynamic Health and I have my first visit in January 2024 (see letter1... etc)
- You said: "You currently have no input from mental health care and report you medication is effective."
I believe that this statement is not consistent with the facts. (Please see the attached report of the last 4 months of CBT therapy)
My psychometric assessment shows severe depression and anxiety and this is why I are now having a fuller mental health assessment with Joe Sheppard at CPFT (please see attached screenshot confirmation of appointment in January).
Because CBT treatment and my medication did not helping me.
Also, after re-examining my initial application, I noticed that I had left out important facts that also affected my award. I'm especially interested in 2 activities.
- Nutrition (eating and drinking)
This word, due to my insufficient knowledge of English and my mental condition, confused me and I simply skipped this activity.
- Communication
This is because at the time of writing the application, my only diagnosis was "ears clogged with wax" and no one was able to say what would happen after the wax was removed.
Although my hearing problems had been progressing for about 20 years, I didn't know whether my hearing would return to an acceptable level after the wax removal procedure.
Therefore, the condition that the ailment must affect me for the next 9 months would not be met. Unfortunately, my hearing will never return to normal and will therefore impact my daily functioning for the rest of my life.
Before making a final decision, please also take into account the letter from my wife, who is my main caregiver and who, I believe, knows me better than I know myself.
Taking all this into account I believe I am eligible for the following points under the PIP criteria, as follows:
Daily Living Component
• Activity 1 – Preparing food. You have awarded 0 points. I believe that…. etc etc etc
still waiting for HP report In the meantime, I wrote an MR template It would be nice to hear the opinion of someone experienced in this process
"I am writing to you to request a mandatory reconsideration following your decision dated 11.12.2023 for my application for PIP. I disagree with the decision not to award PIP the daily living component and the mobility component
In reaching your decision I believe you have not take into account all the circumstances that were not known to you but could have a significant impact on the final award.
• Health Professional Assessment
I would like to emphasize that it is not my intention to question or criticize the assessor or the report itself.
I would rather say that I was misunderstood during the telephone assessment or that the translator (English is not my first language) translated my answers incorrectly.
I believe that an important factor supporting my statement were the conditions in which the assessment took place.
Well, according to the attached documents (please see: audiology report, etc, etc...) I suffer from serious hearing loss.
On the day of the assessment, I didn't have my hearing aids and neck loop yet. In order to understand anything, I had to connect my phone to a portable speaker via Bluetooth, which allowed me to amplify the sound, but not everything was understandable to me.
At the very beginning, the assessor seemed to be very nervous and even started arguing with the interpreter that he was hearing some sounds (probably an echo or some feedback) and could not comfortably conduct the conversation.
I informed her that I use the Bluetooth loudspeaker and I have to hold it close to my ear when I am unable to conduct a conversation on the phone otherwise.
This assessment took a very short time and I think that it was for the reasons I mentioned that the assessor could have based his report on my answers, which were misunderstood translated.
• Decision Marker Report -
You said: "Evidence shows you have no specialist input for any musculoskeletal condition"
I would like to explain to you that I have been under the care of my GP and physiotherapist since February 2023 when I reported my problems.
I was then informed that their procedure involves referral to a physiotherapist who is located in the same medical centre as my GP. If the procedures they propose do not work, I will be referred to an external specialist.
For evidence, please see the attached documents: doc1, doc2, doc4, etc.
As you can see, it is clear from them that I underwent "in-house physiotherapy" and performed the recommended exercises at home. It was only in September that I was referred by my GP to Dynamic Health and I have my first visit in January 2024 (see letter1... etc)
- You said: "You currently have no input from mental health care and report you medication is effective."
I believe that this statement is not consistent with the facts. (Please see the attached report of the last 4 months of CBT therapy)
My psychometric assessment shows severe depression and anxiety and this is why I are now having a fuller mental health assessment with Joe Sheppard at CPFT (please see attached screenshot confirmation of appointment in January).
Because CBT treatment and my medication did not helping me.
Also, after re-examining my initial application, I noticed that I had left out important facts that also affected my award. I'm especially interested in 2 activities.
- Nutrition (eating and drinking)
This word, due to my insufficient knowledge of English and my mental condition, confused me and I simply skipped this activity.
- Communication
This is because at the time of writing the application, my only diagnosis was "ears clogged with wax" and no one was able to say what would happen after the wax was removed.
Although my hearing problems had been progressing for about 20 years, I didn't know whether my hearing would return to an acceptable level after the wax removal procedure.
Therefore, the condition that the ailment must affect me for the next 9 months would not be met. Unfortunately, my hearing will never return to normal and will therefore impact my daily functioning for the rest of my life.
Before making a final decision, please also take into account the letter from my wife, who is my main caregiver and who, I believe, knows me better than I know myself.
Taking all this into account I believe I am eligible for the following points under the PIP criteria, as follows:
Daily Living Component
• Activity 1 – Preparing food. You have awarded 0 points. I believe that…. etc etc etc
The following user(s) said Thank You: VIA, Gary
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Gary
- Offline
Less More
- Posts: 8165
11 months 1 week ago #286569 by Gary
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
Replied by Gary on topic Medication - more points?
Hi honeyhoney
What you have written so far is very good, remember, When applying for PIP, it is not so much the condition per se that the DWP is interested in, but how that condition/s impacts a claimant's daily life and mobility as set out in the PIP criteria.
When you have the assessors report, you will have a better understanding of how the DWP Decision Maker has come to their conclusions and you will now be able to argue against them.
I usually use a highlighter to highlight any inaccuracies, once you have gone through the report you then set out why you are applying for a MR and go through each descriptor one at a time why you disagree with the assessor and try and match it with any supporting documents you may have sent in.
Understand that the assessor is offering an opinion when they say 'in my opinion' you can do the PIP activities, tackling these head-on is unlikely to be successful, you need to show that the basis of that opinion is founded on incorrect information, so try and refer to your evidence to undermine what they have said, remember they are just an opinion which is not based on fact.
Also, try and stick to issues that lead to your scoring points, I often hear members referring to the assessors spelling, as an example, whilst it may show a lack of professionalism, raising it as an issue isn't going to help you get an award.
Your primary task is to show that you meet the criteria, there are many reasons you may have failed, you need to address each of these but don't get bogged down in criticising the assessment report unless you can clearly show that it is incorrect, it is a lot easier to argue the facts of the situation.
Lastly, make sure that you understand the criteria that you are being assessed against you can put the best case forward that is possible but you won't score points if you do not meet the PIP Descriptors.
The first stage to challenging a Decision is for you to request a Mandatory Reconsideration, this needs to be done in writing to the DWP, within one month of the Decision, to the office that dealt with your claim, have a look at our PIP MR & Appeal guide; benefitsandwork.co.uk/guides-for-claimants/pip
For the CRMR1 form to initiate your MR; www.gov.uk/government/publications/chall...ork-and-pensions-dwp
When you have a better idea of the issues with your claim, come back to the forum and we will do our best to help.
Gary
What you have written so far is very good, remember, When applying for PIP, it is not so much the condition per se that the DWP is interested in, but how that condition/s impacts a claimant's daily life and mobility as set out in the PIP criteria.
When you have the assessors report, you will have a better understanding of how the DWP Decision Maker has come to their conclusions and you will now be able to argue against them.
I usually use a highlighter to highlight any inaccuracies, once you have gone through the report you then set out why you are applying for a MR and go through each descriptor one at a time why you disagree with the assessor and try and match it with any supporting documents you may have sent in.
Understand that the assessor is offering an opinion when they say 'in my opinion' you can do the PIP activities, tackling these head-on is unlikely to be successful, you need to show that the basis of that opinion is founded on incorrect information, so try and refer to your evidence to undermine what they have said, remember they are just an opinion which is not based on fact.
Also, try and stick to issues that lead to your scoring points, I often hear members referring to the assessors spelling, as an example, whilst it may show a lack of professionalism, raising it as an issue isn't going to help you get an award.
Your primary task is to show that you meet the criteria, there are many reasons you may have failed, you need to address each of these but don't get bogged down in criticising the assessment report unless you can clearly show that it is incorrect, it is a lot easier to argue the facts of the situation.
Lastly, make sure that you understand the criteria that you are being assessed against you can put the best case forward that is possible but you won't score points if you do not meet the PIP Descriptors.
The first stage to challenging a Decision is for you to request a Mandatory Reconsideration, this needs to be done in writing to the DWP, within one month of the Decision, to the office that dealt with your claim, have a look at our PIP MR & Appeal guide; benefitsandwork.co.uk/guides-for-claimants/pip
For the CRMR1 form to initiate your MR; www.gov.uk/government/publications/chall...ork-and-pensions-dwp
When you have a better idea of the issues with your claim, come back to the forum and we will do our best to help.
Gary
Nothing on this board constitutes legal advice - always consult a professional about specific problems
The following user(s) said Thank You: VIA, honeyhoney
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
Moderators: Gordon, Gary, BIS, Catherine, Wendy, Kelly, greekqueen, peter, Katherine, Super User, Chris, David